Steve Cameron
SC: Steve Cameron
INT: Interviewer
NT: Hello, thanks for coming. Could you tell me your name please?
SC: My name is Steve Cameron. I em, I used to work for the London Borough of Newham for 40 years. I started off as a teacher, teaching at Eastleigh School in Canning Town which started off as a secondary school. I started off there in 78 and in 84 the council adopted policy of establishing, what they then called, ‘Community Schools’, and I don’t mean what might be called community schools now, that are just linked to the local authority, it was a policy in which they wanted to nominate some schools to become community schools, get extra resources in order to develop community activity, including community educational opportunities for adults in the wider population, and that went on and we were very successful community schools with community associations, adult learning and a whole range of activities until 1991. In 1991 they decided, because they couldn’t designate anymore community schools because the funds weren’t there, it was the start of recession, they decided to pull the community schools, who have teachers and other workers there, together and set up what became Newham’s Community Education Service which I became Head off in 1991. The thing was, it although they wanted us to continue with the activity we’d done in schools that was promoting community groups, community education and educational opportunity for people, there wasn’t always great clarity about what that meant. So, we began to develop as an Adult Learning Service because Newham didn’t have one then, and it was at that time, in 1993, that my boss at that time had been approached by Yvonne Humble, who was retiring from New College Further Education and wanted to establish a community visual arts group in Newham and could I find somewhere that would accommodate it. Now the difference was, in those days, I have to say, the context has changed ,we were among people who wanted to promote initiatives and wanted to establish non-profit organisations.
It’s changed a lot since then because of the procurement and tendering things out. You couldn’t be trusted just to work with people, but, however, I was very enthusiastic about this because I’d never seen any visual arts groups really been established in Newham at that time and I was trying to introduce widest curriculum I could to adults in cultural activities they haven’t had the opportunity to before and if they could it was by paying for it and in a community that was a poor as the areas around here, they couldn’t afford to do.
So, the first thing we did to find a location, I approached, local schools because we used to be responsible then for paying form community schools. I approached a primary school in Canning Town because Yvonne expressed an interest in working within the southwest and poorest parts of the borough – that this was and still is to a large extent, and I convinced a school called Rosetta Primary School to let them have a classroom within the school. Tim, who was the Head there, then agreed to it and they moved in as a very small organisation to Rosetta Primary School. The fascinating thing is you wouldn’t be allowed to do that now because of safeguarding issues and all those issues that we have, they were just operating in a classroom with the kid’s classrooms around them. Not that there was any real risk. There were some things that have been, in my opinion, discouraged by the occasional over-reaction to them. I immediately recognised the value being surrounded by people coming to see what they do, by young people coming in to see what they were doing. It was absolutely fascinating to watch!
That went off for two or three years. During that time the service that I was responsible for expanded a larger Adult Learning Service. We became responsible for Fair Play House and Debden House where Yvonne has already run some residential art weekends and Debden House, which is out there in Loughton, and is, in essence still there today. We were able to support that. Then, in 1996 they merged the Community Education Service with the Youth Service and I became Head of that new service which became NewCEYS – Newham Community Education Youth Service. At that time, we were asked to take over this building and we did. It was mainly youth opportunities that we put in here at that time, but it was clear that we didn’t need the whole facility, so I put it to Yvonne that we should move Rosetta into what is now Gainsborough and that’s where it all started. It moved in here and at the same time we began to put on adult learning opportunities within the Rosetta sector framework as well. They were part of our service and that really is how the whole thing became enhanced, but of course Yvonne was an incredible multi-faceted person, and not with the easiest woman to work with, but again, and I always had a fantastic relationship with her, and together, particularly under her leadership and motivation, she’s expanded Rosetta to really what it has become today, to be quite honest followed up then followed by the great people that worked with her, Sanaz and others, who took over from her, a later part of it, and has continued to flourish and I am so proud to be part there at the birth of one of the most successful visual arts organisations in East London. Just as I have told you, it has gone from go strength to strength and at the moment I’m optimistic – the fact they’ve got core funding now from the Arts Council, as well as lots of other funding, and how well-know they are, I am very hopeful do to do as well in the future as they have done in the past.
INT: Is this how you envisaged things back there in the beginning?
SC: No, we just seeded ideas that we thought were worth pursuing and under her leadership and under the leadership is followed her, that’s been proven to be successful and it shows you that you can build a predominantly visual arts organization in an extremely working class and diverse community because the diversity within the framework of Rosetta it’s incredible! I don’t just mean in terms of ethnicity, I’m talking about class, up talking about the fact that we have adults with learning difficulties and disabilities in significant numbers. The other thing we were able to do, when we merge with Youth Service, we were able to start putting in youth activities into Rosetta too because it’s a bit of stereotypes to say that young people have always expressed interested performing arts, but we’ve never promoted visual arts outside schools. In a way that’s good. We started off an initiative called The Community Learning Initiative, again funded by the council, that allowed us to establish summer schools so we put summer school activities for the kids into Rosetta along with a load of other premises and organisations. We started a Saturday school here for kids which is still flourishing, so it’s the breath of what Rosetta offer, in terms of age, and all the other aspects, I think makes it the successful organisation that is become.
INT: Is that it’s unique selling point?
SC: Yes, particularly the professional development courses is etc, the breadth to the curriculum included photography now and a whole range of things, it is one of its selling points, but it is its focus on visual arts to me is a selling point because there’s always been development in performing arts organisations etc, some successful some less successful, but it’s not often that visual arts organisations have developed and have been as successful as Rosetta has in the community of this type and therefore it is a great importance that we protected it I think.
INT: Where do you see Rosetta moving onto from here?
SC: Well, I think, as a trustee, we have designed a great new premises . I think if we can get it
that allows us a range of workshop opportunities together with tuition and galleries. I know we have started discussions about possibility of that maybe looking at the Stratford area in order to do so. We’re now have a new CEO. Sanaz has done a fantastic job as its leader! It’s sad to see a go, but let’s hope Yan, who we’ve pointed, is gonna also develop new ideas and opportunities. So, I’m very hopeful for the future.
INT: Do you see expansion of Rosetta Arts developing in terms of satellite centres?
SC: Well, it already has to some extent. It does deliver something to adult learning centres, but yes I think it could run satellites and I think the balance always when you are delivering the curriculum that is so resourced, you can’t replicate it all the resources quite the same you have in central resource centres, but I know that Rosetta will always make the effort to do what it can to do that. I would hope that, maybe, we can also develop more work directly schools which is something else I think needs to be looked at.
INT: How would you like to work with schools?
SC: The specialist art tutors we have here could really lend something to schools that aren’t necessarily found within the skills of a normal school teaching force – even amongst art teachers. So, a lot of opportunities and at the same time to encourage your people to think that there can be a future, carers wise to realise in visual arts and the media, and I have mentioned media, it’s another thing they might well wish to pursue and Rosetta can help, I mean you know under Yvonne, the famous Alexander McQueen was given assistance by that specialism of Yvonne that helped him on his way to what he became. That must be remembered.
INT: Fewer children are choosing art at the end of year 9 as an option, how could Rosetta plug that gap?
SC: It could be. I have to say that because schools have such individual autonomy, you have to negotiate with individual schools. There is nothing wrong with that, but with the loss local authority status in education, that is more difficult and it’s not resourced by the local authority. Rosetta could work with other local schools, and it does, but it’s not a developed model. I hope it is something the new Chief Exec will take on in the future.
INT: Do you think that would be a drain on the resources having to work with academies, community schools etc.
SC: I hate to say it, but schools tend to be better resourced than the local authority itself, so if anyone has extra resources for tutoring etc, it’s probably schools directly. Schools sometimes carry surpluses in the way that the local authority and other bodies don’t.
INT: Can Rosetta still continue to run free courses for certain cohorts of the community?
SC: I think it’s important it maintains its relationship with Newham Adult Learning Service as you have specialists in curriculum delivery here that you don’t have in adult learning services. It think it has to try and maintain its relationship.
I think lock down in itself, when people started to work from home (which I think is impossible to do I an education service), when people started to shrink back into their activities and when you shrink back to activities, the one thing that can shrink is partnerships as you focus on your own organisational need more. I think it’s not only within learning services, but with a whole range of services. There’s a need for political reflection on the way things are delivered. Services need to be delivered near to the communities that they are for. I don’t mean the courses; I mean the leadership and strategic leadership needs to be close to communities – and you can’t do that sitting at home.
INT: What single piece advice would you give the incoming CEO?
SC: The first piece of advice is that you are taking over a strong organisation. If it’s not broken, then you don’t need to fix it. That’s a comfortable position to start from. I know Yan is just leaving the job in Ealing as the Strategic Leader on Cultural Strategy, to come here to a smaller organisation, but he can use that as well as he is clearly very used to partnership working and in the end, partnerships are the heart of these things. I have to say …public services can be successful in the way private services can’t because public services can develop partnerships in a way that is a more effective form of delivery for not-for-profit organisations. The private sectors seeks, as it always does, profit and monopoly. We need to inspire people in local communities, like Yvonne was – she didn’t live in Newham, but she worked in Newham for many years, to keep their dedication to the community which they felt loyal to, the communities they serve.
